quote:

Originally posted by Sam-:

quote:

Originally posted by Neve Girl:
Kiruv. Keiruv. Queeruv.

Keyroof

One aim of transliteration is to make it clear in the target language what each letter in the original language is. That is the reason that official guides, such as that of the Hebrew Language Academy and of the Library of Congress, specify that the letter qof is represented by a Q, while the letter kaf is represented by a K.

Regarding vowels, hiriq is represented by an I, while tzere is represented by an E. Thus, "qeruv" is the agreed transliteration for qof tzere, resh shuruq, vet.

It's really quite simple once you get the hang of it. Please bear in mind that in qeruv the vowel under the qof is a tzere.

Again I beg to differ Rav, semantics pure semantics. What is essential is that the person gains an understanding of the underling principles and concepts. If we go down this route will will start to discuss the fundamental differences between Sav and Tav, actually this could get very interesting. Nonetheless and I speak for myself here: the underlying principles are what is the tam. Or can we say that the Americans verion of English is more or less than the British?

Mark--
I am still in awe. Good comment.
Shalom,
Y

quote:

find it ironic that this room is called 'mussar' room, and yet people are continually taking a dig at others. Relax, take it easy and enjoy and take a bit of good criticism, its really good for your soul !. PS we have JUST left the Days of Awe, perhaps, we need to be a bit introspective

I am still in Awe. Good comment, Mark ( I rewrote this to put it into context of the conversation.
PS would you gentlemen please do me the favor of commmenting on the thread I started with regard to the "Rebbes I need advice on a goy question" thread I posted under controversial Jewish Issues, please? I want to be certain that my response was Talmudicly responsible and not just a reflection of my own views as a Jewess. I don't mind criticism, so long as it is Torah-based. I just don't want to steer people wrong, as when one answers a goy, that person is for that moment the face of Judaism in my opinion, because the person may never again have another experience with it, so it is important to answer well. Thankyou so much in advance, Shalom! Yocheved

Rav -

I guess according to the rules it would be qeruv. I wasn't aware of the system.

But if someone is going to go through all that trouble, and obviously knows Hebrew spelling very well, and the purpose of the system is to convey the correct spelling, wouldn't it be easier to just download a set of Hebrew fonts and use them?

Why bother going through all that trouble when you could be using and teaching the real thing? Why would someone bother to learn all the details of the system when they could just as easily be spelling in alif-baiz?

lol

DOes anyone know the best place to get a free download of Hebrew? I went to different sites and ended up with a bunch of unuseable mess that just takes up memory and requires all these special programs to utilize. I am really frustrated. Thanks

PS I like the calligraphic ones best, but will settle for whatever I can get.

quote:

Originally posted by Mark G:
Again I beg to differ Rav, semantics pure semantics.

Sorry, Mark. Semantics is one thing, and transliteration is another. I understand that Hebrew is not your native language, and linguistics is not your field.

Nevertheless, just as you can speak with poor grammar, or write with multiple misspellings, so can you transliterate incorrectly. And for the most part, you will be understood. But just as bad grammar and misspelling marks one's level, so does incorrect transliteration.

quote:

Nonetheless and I speak for myself here: the underlying principles are what is the tam. Or can we say that the Americans version of English is more or less than the British?

That is totally not the point. There is such a thing as good British usage, just as there is such a thing as good American usage. But there are also bad usages of the English language, both British and American. And there is accepted transliteration principles, according to the standards set by the professionals involved in the field, and there is erroneous transliteration.

And Mark, this has nothing to do with semantics. It is just a case of proper usage.

Hi Yocheved, Im not sure what you mean by a free download of Hebrew. If you mean Hebrew fonts, thats no problem I have sources for quite a few. If you need a program in order to be able to WRITE then you need to get a program like Davka writer and there are a few freebies such as classical text editor which writes right to left. You can use a program such as Microsoft Word to do the same (so long as you have Hebrew fonts installed) and the free open source program called Open Office which is the derivative of MSword, but of course free. If you can be a bit more specific, I am sure that I can be of assistance.

quote:

Originally posted by Yocheved Broscova-Guerra:
DOes anyone know the best place to get a free download of Hebrew?

Windows XP has Hebrew capability built in. You will need your installation disk. Go to Control Panel > Regional and Language Options > Languages > Details.

Similarly, Office XP and 2003 have Hebrew capabilities built in. You do not need a special version, unless you want the menus in Hebrew.

Yes, sir, bOTH are needed. I have a single font on the computer under MSWord, but I find it strange as it doesn't even write my name ccorrectly. I realize spellings differ, as even David is Dalet-vav-dalet in some places and a yod is in other places (would be interesting to know what Talmud says about that, but that is just a thought). I definitely need a writer program, but also a better font program. Thankyou for advice

quote:

Originally posted by Yocheved Broscova-Guerra:
Yes, sir, bOTH are needed. I have a single font on the computer under MSWord, but I find it strange as it doesn't even write my name ccorrectly. I realize spellings differ, as even David is Dalet-vav-dalet in some places and a yod is in other places (would be interesting to know what Talmud says about that, but that is just a thought). I definitely need a writer program, but also a better font program. Thankyou for advice

It would be helpful if you could indicate to which post you are replying.
You need to install Hebrew, as I stated above. Which version of Windows are you using? If it is 98 or ME, then you need a special version. XP already has the Hebrew capability, but not if you have not yet installed it.

YOU DO NOT need a speceial “writer program.” Both Word XP (and later versions) and Open Office have Hebrew built in. Once you install Hebrew and one of these programs, you have simultaneously installed Hebrew fonts. If you need more Hebrew fonts, you can find some free ones for downloading, and there are hundreds that you can purchase.

Thankyou. The one I have in the Word program transliterates--that is to say, they will write the corresponding letter I write into it (not necessarily the sound, and Hebrew is an oral tradition and the sounds are more important than their English letter counterparts) soooo...perhaps it is more precise to say that I need a TRANSLATING program which would run English into Hebrew for those words I don't know. (?)

quote:

Originally posted by Rav Alter:
That is the reason that official guides, such as that of the Hebrew Language Academy and of the Library of Congress, specify that the letter qof is represented by a Q, while the letter kaf is represented by a K.

Artscroll I see uses the letter "K" for the "koof" in Tzadik. See the picture here of a sample page of their Yom Kippur Transliterated Machzor, and look for the third word "latzadik" and so on for each word on that page that the Hebrew word has "Koof" it uses a "K".

Rav Alter,

2000, I think

Yocheved,
Please indicate just which post you are referring to.
I think that Windows 2000 has built-in Hebrew support. Try following my instructions above.

quote:

Thankyou. The one I have in the Word program transliterates--that is to say, they will write the corresponding letter I write into it (not necessarily the sound, and Hebrew is an oral tradition and the sounds are more important than their English letter counterparts)

Sorry, but I could not figure out the relevance of what you wrote here, nor could I understand it. But it is clear that you have not yet installed Hebrew support. Please do so before asking further questions.

quote:

soooo...perhaps it is more precise to say that I need a TRANSLATING program which would run English into Hebrew for those words I don't know. (?)

Translation is something else altogether. But, with the right add-on (not free) for Word XP or 2003 you can translate individual words. Perhaps you want to purchase a Hebrew-English dictionary (hard copy).

You keep changing your requirements, so it is next to impossible to provide a solution.

Artscroll does not follow the professional rules for transliteration. If you want to know why, please check with them. The example quoted by Sam is not the only one.

Rav Alter:

OK, I will follow yourinsrructions. The translating programs I am certain will not be free, but the Ibrit you are speaking of for the Windows is, and I obviously do not have the most recent downloads. My computer skills are not comparable to these youngsters out here, so trying to identify the term for what I need isn't even easy. Let me try acquiring those from Windows and then go from there. The dictionary is not the problem, as it does not help with grammar very much. I think I will try visiting some online stores and seeing what is available as well as taking the advice you kindly offered. Toda!
Yocheved

Quote "As a general rule, any Kohen may bless us, provided he has not killed anyone. So that it appears that the rules for Kohanim may be less stringent"

The Mishna Brurah 128:134 Pasul a Mechalel Shabbos B'Farhesya from making Birchas Kohanim. Also those who are Oiver on Aveiros of Kehuna (marrying a Divorcee or being M'Tameh to dead) are also Pasul

quote:

Originally posted by Rav Alter:
Artscroll does not follow the professional rules for transliteration.

Do you have a source for what are the "professional rules"?