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<RobNE>
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"What do you do with these Gemaras? There are clear sources which state there is a decline in generations. I have more Gemaras if you want."

"Eiruvin 53a. R. Johanan further stated:..."

"Shabbath 112b: R. Zera said in Raba b. Zimuna's name: If the earlier scholars were sons of angels, we are sons of men; and if the earlier scholars were sons of men, we are like asses,.."

I understand your interpretation of these sayings in the Talmud; they are a common Orthodox view. What I don't understand, however, is the lack of other Orthodox views, including statements from as early as the Tosefta, to as late as Orthodox rabbis today. Many rabbinic Jews in the past and present read these quotes, along with others, and come to the opposite conclusion, at least in practice. (In other words, in theory the previous view is accepted, but not as far as practical halakhic decision making.)

The saying quoted above comes from Talmud Bavli, Shabbat 112b. Note that other versions of this saying exist in Talmud Yerusahlmi Demai 1:3, 21d; Talmud Yerushalmi Shekalim 5:1, 48c-d.


Yet this proverb refers only to self-sacrifice in the observance of mitzvot. In legal matters, our sages had the opposite approach, as expressed by Rabbi Dosa ben Hyrcanus in the Mishnah:

"Then Moses and Aaron, Nadav and Avihu, and seventy eldars of Israel ascended" (Exodus 24:9) And why were the names of the eldars not listed? To teach that every three [judges] who have served as court of law are equal in authority to the court of Moses. Talmud Bavli, Rosh HaShanah 2:9

Doesn't that quote reverse the meaning of the original two?

The Tosefta adds to this: "The court of Yerubal was as great in the eyes of God as the court of Moses. The court of Yiftah was as great in the eyes of God as the court of Samuel. To teach you that whoever is appointed a leader over the community - even the most worthless - must be considered like the mightiest of the mighty." [Tosefta Rosh HaShanah 1:18, cf. Bavli Rosh HaShanah 25b.]

Contrary to the popular beliefs, halakha has never required that a Bet Din be a Sanhedrin, or wiser than the original Bet Din, in order to change Jewish law. Orthodox Rabbi Mendell Lewittes writes that "even in Talmudic times it was realized that the dictum 'One Bet Din cannot annul the decree of another Bet Din unless it is greater in both wisdom and numbers' was so restrictive that it had to be rescinded.

For example "Actually, the Sages themselves found the key to unlock the gates of burdensome restriction. Thus Rabbi Gamaliel and his Bet Din cancelled the pre-Sabbatical year restriction imposed by Bet Shammai and bet Hillel. When some Amoraim questioned this cancellation...the answer, given after a moment's hesitation, was that those who made the gezerah originally did so on the condition that if a later authority sees fit to cancel it, they may do so. (Moed Katan 3b)." [Lewittes, p.96]

In theory, the earlier generations are so much greater than us that we are powerless to act. But in practice halakha has always held otherwise. This is an Orthodox view, but not the only Orthodox view.



Rob
 
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Shalom! Please post this at http://globalyeshiva.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/860104083/m/6631078261/p/1

I closed this topic because this is a continuation of that thread.

Thanks


If not now, when?
 
Posts: 2176 | Location: Jerusalem, Israel | Registered: December 04, 2003Report This Post
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