quote:

Originally posted by Hawke:
Well, my first thought is this.......wouldn't tuma be everywhere then if you're going to give it so many thousands of miles boundary? Why stop with Australia? Why not carry this on in a direct line through the whole universe and every inch of space, planet or star that falls in the direct line is also part of it? It doesn't make sense.

Tuma just doesn't spread everywhere as you suggest. It goes directly upwards. If there is an Ohel [a covering] over it, then anyone who is under the Ohel will become defiled by the Tuma. Tuma also passes by touching it and, in some cases, either by carrying it or sitting on it.

Does that make sense? Remember, no Mitzvah in the Torah has to make sense to us (the dietary laws are a good example).

quote:

Originally posted by Rav Chaim:
Quote "came out that there was one suggestion to issue body bags to Kohein passengers which they could put themselves into for those parts of any flight flying over a Jewish cemetery"

I would imagine that it would be made of a fabric that is not Mikabel Tumah, like nylon etc. Therefore, it would be a Tzemed Pusul, (a covered utensil that does not receives tumah at least from the outside.)

Oh for heaven's sake, stop!!!! Enlarging Mitzvot this far makes it impossible to do anything.

Bingo! Then wouldn't the Mantle of the Earth(under the crust) serve as an Ohel for the Core and anything on the other side of it, say in Australia? AND....then it's impossible for Australia to be effected by the tumah because it is under and not over, except that someone was worried a few logs back about it spreading a certain distance under and specifically mentioned Australia. As far as burning tumah/impurity, didn't the angel put a hot coal on the prophet's tongue to purify him? I know I'm right about this. Anytime there is a disease, we burn the "physical" tumah. When there is a burnt sacrifice (key word burnt) it could be said we are burning the tumah of our sin. Right? And when I mentioned it spreading everywhere I was being facetious. I was trying to express how I thought that we were going a little overboard on this problem.

quote:

Originally posted by Yisroel Phillips:
Tuma just doesn't spread everywhere as you suggest. It goes directly upwards. If there is an Ohel [a covering] over it, then anyone who is under the Ohel will become defiled by the Tuma. Tuma also passes by touching it and, in some cases, either by carrying it or sitting on it.

Does that make sense? Remember, no Mitzvah in the Torah has to make sense to us (the dietary laws are a good example).

B"H

My dear Mrs. Hawke,

I could not help but be amused by your outspoken way of "defying" what has been suggested in the few preceding posts on this thread. With no offence, if I might just refresh your memory, all Koheinim (priests of Aaron's descent and lineage) are presently defiled by corpse uncleanness (tumas mes). However, there is an ongoing restriction concerning them from entering any graveyard or cemetery, or from adding defilement to their own defilement. For this reason, some have sought answers to the problem of flying over graveyards where the tuma'ah (defilement) arises vertically into the heavens.

Our Mishnah plainly brings down examples of materials that would not contract uncleanness. Stone pots that are sealed, for example, do not contract corpse uncleanness; neither do they convey uncleanness to what lies within the pot. So, too, are there other materials that would not contract uncleaness by the other types of defilement that exist in our world.

The discussion might seem trivial to you, but when the Bes Hamikdash is once again built some day, may it happen quickly in our own days, these issues will become very real to you and to all of us.

Sincerely,
david

quote:

Originally posted by Hawke:
Bingo! Then wouldn't the Mantle of the Earth(under the crust) serve as an Ohel for the Core and anything on the other side of it, say in Australia? AND....then it's impossible for Australia to be effected by the tumah because it is under and not over, except that someone was worried a few logs back about it spreading a certain distance under and specifically mentioned Australia. As far as burning tumah/impurity, didn't the angel put a hot coal on the prophet's tongue to purify him? I know I'm right about this. Anytime there is a disease, we burn the "physical" tumah. When there is a burnt sacrifice (key word burnt) it could be said we are burning the tumah of our sin. Right? And when I mentioned it spreading everywhere I was being facetious. I was trying to express how I thought that we were going a little overboard on this problem.

You know, I will happily debate Torah with someone who is ignorant but wants to learn. What I don't feel like doing is debating with someone whose underlying intention is to mock the Torah and our Sages, which clearly applies to you, Hawke.

Quote "Oh for heaven's sake, stop!!!! Enlarging Mitzvot this far makes it impossible to do anything."

It's obvious from your response (and from other posts as well), that you have very little idea of what is going on in the Torah and what the Mitzvos. What I have written is elementary to anyone who went through the parts of the Torah dealing with these issues.

But I'm bewildered by your objection in general. (There seems to be hurt in your posts. I don't think you argue with surgeons why you need to make surgery for hours, just snip here and there, sew it up and finish. So why are you so offended if a Rabbi who understands the technicalities of the Mitzvos is explaining them?) Is it that you feel uncomfortable with people who have more Torah knowledge, that makes you feel inadequate. Or is it people that keep the Mitzvos more correct than you that makes you feel inadequate?

BTW, I'm explaining it the way Hashem wants me to, so I'm doing it for heaven's sake


Quote "I know I'm right about this. Anytime there is a disease, we burn the "physical" tumah. When there is a burnt sacrifice (key word burnt) it could be said we are burning the tumah of our sin. Right?"

This doesn't make an iota of sense!!!

1. Tumeh goes up, not sideways.
2. In one is in a sealed box like a plane, some authorities would consider this the same as travelling over tumeh in a midgal and tevah as described in the gemara. However, one can't ignore a posek of the rank of Rav Ovadiah if he poskins otherwise.

Aryeh

Yes. And I was shocked with how you talked to the Rav. It is very unseemly behaviour all round for you. You should be ashamed of yourself.

What do you want from here that you are so oppositional? Do you have an issue with Judaism. Are you really Jewish? That was not a rhetorical question. Are you deeply troubled about something and try to deal with it like this?

This wonderful web site is here as a much needed resource for people who want to further their knowledge of Judaism, not to mention to further other important religious goals, but you treat it and us with such frivoloty, lack of respect, lack of connection, and aggression. Do you really have to do this? Everybody is trying very hard to be here for you.

quote:

It's obvious from your response (and from other posts as well), that you have very little idea of what is going on in the Torah and what the Mitzvos. What I have written is elementary to anyone who went through the parts of the Torah dealing with these issues.

Quote " In one is in a sealed box like a plane, some authorities would consider this the same as travelling over tumeh in a midgal and tevah as described in the gemara. "


What is the reason for this? Since it's metal it is Mikabel Tumah even though it's big enough not to be able to carry full or empty. The Migdal and Tevah are wood, so they are big enough not to have Tumah and thus protect it.