Go to Our New Site
Weekly Torah Updates

Home    Forums  Hop To Forum Categories  Torah Forums  Hop To Forums  Beis Medrash    Disaster on Erev Shabbat
Page 1 2 

Read-Only Read-Only Topic
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
-star Rating Rate It!  Login/Join 
GY Teacher

Picture of Rav Chaim
Posted Hide Post
About the problems #2,#3 and 4, I don't think is relevant to this question, since Internet shops has nothing to do with the Internet provider. Also, nowadays, I don't think anybody pays per hour but only per month


1) Lifnai Eever wouldn't apply, since they can get other servers. Misayay Lovrei Aveirah probably plays a bigger role in Israel than in America, since the whole thing is made for Jews, while in America the Jews are just an after thought. why would this be different than selling a car to a Frei Jew? Why isn't helping him to drive on Shabbos?

5) It isn't apparent to anyone that it's taking any work on Shabbos. Just that people knows it runs on Shabbos, it could be just by itself without maintenance. If the place of fixing is out of the The Tchum of Jews.


____________

http://limudtorah.jewishweb.org

Please help the Global Yeshiva to continue spreading high quality Torah by sponsoring a Shiur
in the "Understanding Mishna Brurah" forum. All sponsorships are tax deductible.
 
Posts: 1819 | Location: Michigan | Registered: June 25, 2004Report This Post

Picture of laurence shore
Posted Hide Post
To get the basic problem of Shabbat goi, there is a lot confusion as our forefathers in Europe made use of Shabbat goi in situations which no longer are a problem. The basic problem of lighting the fire in the house on Shabbat morning. It was excused as פקוח נפש since children were very likely to be injured by the severe cold. However, many Poskim on good logical grounds disagreed.
Most poskim tended to be more lenient when with the non-Jewish servant. For example, if you couldn't light shabbat candles, you can give the non-Jew very strong hints as to what you would like to be done.
As for giving work to goi, it is best that it not be done on the premises where your house is.
I don't know of any large computer user who doesn't have 24/7, one to five hour service from the technical service. This a contract and you don't pay anyone anything above your global contract. I did have trouble getting ahold of a needed part on a Sunday which was the fouth of July in Philadelphia but the delay was still close to the five hour period.

Aryeh Shore
 
Posts: 548 | Location: Rechovot, Israel | Registered: February 11, 2005Report This Post

Posted Hide Post
quote:
For example, if you couldn't light shabbat candles, you can give the non-Jew very strong hints as to what you would like to be done.


Are you really saying that a Goy could light our ritual 2 or more Shabbos candles for us? Or perhaps this was more regarding a candle for utilitarian use, such as a torch light?

If one had the practice of adding a candle forever if they ever forgot to light, would they be exempt from the additional candle in the above circumstance?
 
Posts: 897 | Location: USA | Registered: May 30, 2004Report This Post
<Hawke>
Posted
I think a Jew can, but the real question is whether a Jew should, right?

Maybe being a light unto the nations involves sticking with our principles and maybe some of the non-jews need to take a break that they otherwise wouldn't, since many people work seven days a week.

Does anyone have Verizon DSL?
Do you remember how many times they go off line for whole days at a time in the middle of the week? No one is going to die if the server is down for 24 hours.

Let it rest.
 
Report This Post
GY Teacher

Picture of Rav Chaim
Posted Hide Post
Quote "The basic problem of lighting the fire in the house on Shabbat morning. It was excused as פקוח נפש since children were very likely to be injured by the severe cold. However, many Poskim on good logical grounds disagreed."

It's not because that it's a threat to life, but you're allowed to tell a Goy to do anything for the needs of the sick. The children are considered "sick" for being in the cold, so you're allowed to tell a Goy to make a fire for them. If it's really cold, even adults are considered "sick" towards the cold, and a Goy may make a fire for them too. The problem is if it's really not that cold, but you just want the heat to be more comfortable. This is all found in SHulchin Orech 276:5

Quote "Most poskim tended to be more lenient when with the non-Jewish servant."

Who are these Poskim? What difference is it if it's a servant or any other Goy?

Quote "For example, if you couldn't light shabbat candles, you can give the non-Jew very strong hints as to what you would like to be done."

There are two instances of this. During Bein Hashmashas, you may ask a Goy to light candles if you didn't. This comes under the rule, all things that are only prohibited Midarabanan are permitted during Bein Hashmashes (if for the need of a Mitzvah.) This is brought in 261:1

In 276:2 The Rama brings a Shita that says you're allowed to have a Goy light a lamp for you since it's a need for a Mitzvah. The Rama says you shouldn't protest them (since it's better for them to do it Shogeg than to do it on purpose, since they won't listen to you) but you shouldn't rely on it unless in a time of big need, since most Rishonim disagree. MB 24 brings Shla that even then you can't rely on it


____________

http://limudtorah.jewishweb.org

Please help the Global Yeshiva to continue spreading high quality Torah by sponsoring a Shiur
in the "Understanding Mishna Brurah" forum. All sponsorships are tax deductible.
 
Posts: 1819 | Location: Michigan | Registered: June 25, 2004Report This Post
GY Teacher

Picture of Rav Chaim
Posted Hide Post
Quote "I think a Jew can"

What's the reason for this?

Quote "maybe some of the non-jews need to take a break that they otherwise wouldn't, since many people work seven days a week."

First, that's none of our business what Goyim do. It's not for us to push things on them

Second, it's prohibited for a Goy to keep Shabbos.


____________

http://limudtorah.jewishweb.org

Please help the Global Yeshiva to continue spreading high quality Torah by sponsoring a Shiur
in the "Understanding Mishna Brurah" forum. All sponsorships are tax deductible.
 
Posts: 1819 | Location: Michigan | Registered: June 25, 2004Report This Post

Posted Hide Post
quote:
so you're allowed to tell a Goy to make a fire for them. If it's really cold, even adults are considered "sick" towards the cold, and a Goy may make a fire for them too.


Rav Chaim:

If its very cold outside and we are quite certain that it will get too cold inside within a short amount of time, since the previous fire is already out, is that a sufficient reason under this halacha to ask a goy to start a new fire to prevent dangerous cold which could cause sickness?
 
Posts: 897 | Location: USA | Registered: May 30, 2004Report This Post
GY Teacher

Picture of Rav Chaim
Posted Hide Post
Quote "If its very cold outside and we are quite certain that it will get too cold inside within a short amount of time, since the previous fire is already out, is that a sufficient reason under this halacha to ask a goy to start a new fire to prevent dangerous cold which could cause sickness?"

Most certainly.


____________

http://limudtorah.jewishweb.org

Please help the Global Yeshiva to continue spreading high quality Torah by sponsoring a Shiur
in the "Understanding Mishna Brurah" forum. All sponsorships are tax deductible.
 
Posts: 1819 | Location: Michigan | Registered: June 25, 2004Report This Post
 Previous Topic | Next Topic powered by eve community Page 1 2  

Read-Only Read-Only Topic

Home    Forums  Hop To Forum Categories  Torah Forums  Hop To Forums  Beis Medrash    Disaster on Erev Shabbat


Weekly Torah Updates
Enter your Email


Preview